Am I better than you?
Hi all, I saw a programme last night where actor Paul Nichols went to India to explore Hinduism. It was a fairly basic introduction but showed how the devotees of Hinduism were really calm, peaceful and humble.
It then proceeded to show 'New Age' Hinduism where a group of Westerners were receiving teachings from a revered woman and Paul Nichols asked her some questions about the practices and she answered them in the typically humble style which was shown by Hindus throughout the programme. Then one British guy, obviously offended by his questioning of the woman, started to have a go at Paul while trying to come across as 'spiritual' etc.
Paul Nichols cut him down to size by turning to him and quite rightly saying that he was being very egotistical and contrary to the teachings and practices of Hinduism, which leads me to my point.
Some people seem to think that they are better than others for various reasons and this is evident in the postings about spiritual topics and especially systems of reiki/healing. Paul Nichols summed it up in one sentence which was something along the lines of 'as long as I can accept who I am and what I do and it makes me happy'.
No fighting for supremecy because the only battle is accepting yourself.
Is everybody else tired of the 'I am more spiritual than you because...' attitude? I know I am.
Darren
Answers:
Yes, I am.
Answers:
Me too!!! Definitely agree with the sentiment of accepting ourselves and being happy - I do try and stick with this myself and it usually works except when having one of my more neurotic moments![sm=hippy.gif]
I saw this advertised and meant to watch it - bother! Have to hold out for the repeat.
Anyway I think we should accept ourselves and each other and just learn to let it be[sm=grouphug.gif]
Answers:
Hi Mrharper2u
I agree that ego doesnt have a place anywhere really because it is rarely helpful to any situation.
I do wonder though if sometimes on the threads that you are possibly refering to if sometimes we mistake things for ego but really its more about passion. A lot of people on here are passionate on their various subjects and sometimes I think they genuinely believe in things and are just desperate to make other people seewhat they believe, not so much for their ego but wanting to share.
Anyway thats just a thought I had :D
Shame I didnt see the program it sounds like it would have been very interesting.
peace, Reikilight x
Answers:
BRAVO!!! Well said!
Answers:
This is an interesting thread.
To my inquisitive mind, I wonder why some people do this "more spiritual than you" thing. The first answer that comes to my mind is ego. But then the ego is the self, the will. So I ask another question; "is this because something has been taken away from this person against their will, leaving a hole there to be filled?"
So, taking this further, is there a hole to be filled with spirituality and the person fears losing it - having it taken away from them like the first thing? Is this why they get so possessive of it? Which means they can never really have it, because it isn't something you own? Will this person be free to be truly spiritual if this hole is filled with something they can own more, like self-esteem?
What do you think?
Answers:
Hi Suzanne[/align][/align]I don't think that argument is quite right as we do own our own spirituality, it is not something we are given, though we are responsible for developing it through personal spiritual development, we do get help though with this but it is still ours.[/align][/align]The problems seem to occur mostly when we are not open to other peoples interpretations of their own spiritual enlightenment, everyone is different and different people require different things both spiritually and physically to evolve.[/align]
Answers:
Exactly Paul,
We need to be willing to listen and learn from other people. If we choose to accept those things then fine, but if we aren't happy then that is our opinion and we shouldn't impose that on others. Discuss, yes, argue, no.
Nobody can honestly put their hand on their heart and say they know the truth and they know better.
Love and Reiki Hugs
Answers:
Totally agree. I used to go to Findhorn a lot because it was a "spiritual community" and had a great atmosphere, however it has been overrun by people exuding "spirituality" and now looks like a well heeled suburb with huge eco friendly houses - everyone used to live in brightly painted static caravan or cabins. Not only are they now more "spiritual" they are also more "eco-friendly". Puts me off.....
(Better add, I am eco friendly but not inyourface/lookatmesavingtheplanet/idomorethanyou about it.)
Answers:
Isn't this an issue about our attitude? Surely there are those who post here who are "better at" Healing than we are. Can we not learn from those who are "better at" something than we are?
How do we progress spiritualy if we can't recognise those who are "better at" something than we are?
This doesn't mean a person is "better than" us, they are only "better at" something. If I were looking for someone to teach me piano, I would expect them to be "better at" playing the piano but that doesn't mean they are "better than" me as a person, especially as each person is unique anyway so the comparison is meaningless. I'ts a bit like saying that salt is"better than" pepper. Salt is "betterat" flavouring certain things but it isn't superior to pepper or "better than" pepper because like salt, pepper has it's unique quality and function.
Being able to move away from our feelings and concerns of self and what we think of others and what others think of us and this concern of who is worthy to teach us something, is a spiritual trap we all fall into.
How many of us seek a teacher? Someone who is "better at" this spiritual stuff than we are?
Whilst we are concerned with these issues we cannot find a teacher because we will not be able to recognise they are "better at" something than we are. The teaching is not the teacher and the learning is not the student.
Our attitude to spiritual growth is important. Everyone can teach us something if we have an open mind attitude and a desire and willingness to learn. We are either comitted to growing spiritually or not. If we are not that's ok. If we are comitted, then surely we need to be able to put our thoughts and feelings aside because our spiritual growth and our search for "truth" (whatever that is) is more important thanour feelings of pride, inadequacy, embarassement, suspicion, jealousy, inferiority, vanity, worries, concernsetc, etc because someone is "better at" something than I am.
The good teacherwould neverconsider themselves "better than" any student. They are only "better at" something. Personalities are not the teaching.
When the student is ready, the teacher appears precisely because the student has put these issues aside. Until then, the student cannot learn and the teacher has no one to teach.
:)
Bless
Better than all of you ;)
Bryan
Answers:
Hi Bryan[/align][/align]Do you not consider that our thoughts and feelings are strongly intertwined with our intuition, it is all well and good saying put them aside in the pursuit of spiritual insight and understanding, but if we don't use them then how do we know when we are being steered in the wrong direction.[/align][/align]It is the same when we look for energy connections, if we do not seek with out thoughts and feelings then how do we know if the connection is a good one or a bad one for us, without using our natural abilities it can be aperilous journey.[/align][/align]Thoughts and feeling are our first line of defence, we switch them of at our own peril, I always listen to new ideas andconcepts, but that is not the same as me being a garbage truck with takes onboard everything people throw at it, everything needs to be received with discernment.[/align][/align]We evaluatefirstly our own experiences and consider if the concept fits our remit or understanding, then we evaluate if this concept sits right with us,does it feel right to take onboard, if yes we then test the water and if that all passes muster then we can plunge in and grasp it with both hands.[/align]
Answers:
I've no idea Paul.
I think I was talking about attitude. A mind set which prevents us learning about ourselves and our trying not to think in terms of "better than", which is not a helpful attitude if we are commited to our spiritual growth.
Not really talking here about chosing a teacher. Every experience, even going down the wrong path and beingsteered in the wrong direction,as you put it, can be beneficial if we have the right "attitude"...There are no mistakes...there are only experiences.
We are responsible for the choices we make, no one else. And we can chose to think in terms of others being "better at" something than we are rather than "better than" us... if we want to.
"Better than" attitude doesn't help anyone does it? It simply makes a judgment and stays where it is in a comfort zone. In ego. If we are to grow we have toexamine those issues of the personality which are determined to prevent us from growing and keep us where we are.
Our attitude to learning affects the learning experience. Whilst we are stuck in the "personality issues" of ourselves and others then we can't grow. It's like saying..I'll change when the world changes but not until.
We can make many excuses for not "doing the work" and personality issues is a great excuse for not doing the work. It puts the responsibility on someone or something else.
The only thingthat is important is to grow. And if we are committed to grow then we must examine, if we are not growing, why we are not. In all cases it is our attitude, our mind set and as you know..the mind set which solves a problem is not the same mind set which created it.
Therefore we have to change at a personality level firstnot expect the "other" person or issue to change first and apologise to youfor being there and disturbing you in your comfort zone. This is a lesson in courage. To dare to learn those things about ourselves which we are reluctant to face.
That "other" person or the "issue"is the material which we needfor our spiritual growth. For spiritual work and growth, it is the materialwith which we have to do the work...not the material with which to make excuses about and dismiss so we can avoid the lessons so needed to help us to grow.
It is easy to dimiss that which in actual fact is the very thing we need to face to help us to move on. All experience is positive...if we have the right attitude..in other words...what is this expereince teaching me?
We are either students to life and what life has to teach us or not. Our choice and our responsibility.
To be committed to our growth means we take these things on and face them. Until then, life teaches us the same lesson over and over again in subtle disguises of the same truth and the same lesson.
"Better than" and "better at" is a lesson. When we learn it..we move on. When we don't , we are stuck in it and it's our responsibility, our challenge, no one elses.
Hope that helps
Bless
Bryan
Answers:
I thought it worth repeating Reikilight's point, as I think it is a valid one which can stand alongside Bryan's one concerning attitude.
If I can offer a personal example, for several years I grew upset and angry at a teacher because when I tried to share my passion about my spiritual path experiences, she closed me off. At last we had a heart to heart discussion and I managed to tell her how much she and hurt me through her assumption that I was boasting, when in actual fact I was trying to share. I wonder how many others struggle with this misunderstanding until they can stand outwith it and see the truth?
The other point I wish to make is this - if you feel a posting is ego-ridden, then the answer is simple - don't read it again. Allow the 'irk' to go and move on, because in the end, it is only one person's viewpoint/reality and why should you let it disturb yours? (speaking from the viewpoint of someone who has noticed this yearhow much she can be knocked off balance by ill-advised emotion directed toward a post.. lol)
Blessings
Moonfeather
Answers:
I agree with this in principle, Moonfeather. However, it think it should also be borne in mind that many people come to this forum seeking advice about Reiki, when either they are about to embark on the journey, or have maybe taken some first steps and are seeking reassurance and further knowledge.
At this stage they may not have sufficient experience to be able to differentiate between what are "facts" and what might be someone passionately believing that theirs is the only right and proper way, and coming across as rather "my way or the highway". Then I think a polite post to this effect is OK, because while my own viewpoint/reality might not be affected one little bit, I recognise that for others it might be different, and they might go away with the impresson that what they are doing, or what they have been taught is "wrong". I do try to remember that I once wore L plates! ;)
Holistic
It then proceeded to show 'New Age' Hinduism where a group of Westerners were receiving teachings from a revered woman and Paul Nichols asked her some questions about the practices and she answered them in the typically humble style which was shown by Hindus throughout the programme. Then one British guy, obviously offended by his questioning of the woman, started to have a go at Paul while trying to come across as 'spiritual' etc.
Paul Nichols cut him down to size by turning to him and quite rightly saying that he was being very egotistical and contrary to the teachings and practices of Hinduism, which leads me to my point.
Some people seem to think that they are better than others for various reasons and this is evident in the postings about spiritual topics and especially systems of reiki/healing. Paul Nichols summed it up in one sentence which was something along the lines of 'as long as I can accept who I am and what I do and it makes me happy'.
No fighting for supremecy because the only battle is accepting yourself.
Is everybody else tired of the 'I am more spiritual than you because...' attitude? I know I am.
Darren
Answers:
Yes, I am.
Answers:
Me too!!! Definitely agree with the sentiment of accepting ourselves and being happy - I do try and stick with this myself and it usually works except when having one of my more neurotic moments![sm=hippy.gif]
I saw this advertised and meant to watch it - bother! Have to hold out for the repeat.
Anyway I think we should accept ourselves and each other and just learn to let it be[sm=grouphug.gif]
Answers:
Hi Mrharper2u
I agree that ego doesnt have a place anywhere really because it is rarely helpful to any situation.
I do wonder though if sometimes on the threads that you are possibly refering to if sometimes we mistake things for ego but really its more about passion. A lot of people on here are passionate on their various subjects and sometimes I think they genuinely believe in things and are just desperate to make other people seewhat they believe, not so much for their ego but wanting to share.
Anyway thats just a thought I had :D
Shame I didnt see the program it sounds like it would have been very interesting.
peace, Reikilight x
Answers:
BRAVO!!! Well said!
Answers:
This is an interesting thread.
To my inquisitive mind, I wonder why some people do this "more spiritual than you" thing. The first answer that comes to my mind is ego. But then the ego is the self, the will. So I ask another question; "is this because something has been taken away from this person against their will, leaving a hole there to be filled?"
So, taking this further, is there a hole to be filled with spirituality and the person fears losing it - having it taken away from them like the first thing? Is this why they get so possessive of it? Which means they can never really have it, because it isn't something you own? Will this person be free to be truly spiritual if this hole is filled with something they can own more, like self-esteem?
What do you think?
Answers:
Hi Suzanne[/align][/align]I don't think that argument is quite right as we do own our own spirituality, it is not something we are given, though we are responsible for developing it through personal spiritual development, we do get help though with this but it is still ours.[/align][/align]The problems seem to occur mostly when we are not open to other peoples interpretations of their own spiritual enlightenment, everyone is different and different people require different things both spiritually and physically to evolve.[/align]
Answers:
Exactly Paul,
We need to be willing to listen and learn from other people. If we choose to accept those things then fine, but if we aren't happy then that is our opinion and we shouldn't impose that on others. Discuss, yes, argue, no.
Nobody can honestly put their hand on their heart and say they know the truth and they know better.
Love and Reiki Hugs
Answers:
Totally agree. I used to go to Findhorn a lot because it was a "spiritual community" and had a great atmosphere, however it has been overrun by people exuding "spirituality" and now looks like a well heeled suburb with huge eco friendly houses - everyone used to live in brightly painted static caravan or cabins. Not only are they now more "spiritual" they are also more "eco-friendly". Puts me off.....
(Better add, I am eco friendly but not inyourface/lookatmesavingtheplanet/idomorethanyou about it.)
Answers:
Isn't this an issue about our attitude? Surely there are those who post here who are "better at" Healing than we are. Can we not learn from those who are "better at" something than we are?
How do we progress spiritualy if we can't recognise those who are "better at" something than we are?
This doesn't mean a person is "better than" us, they are only "better at" something. If I were looking for someone to teach me piano, I would expect them to be "better at" playing the piano but that doesn't mean they are "better than" me as a person, especially as each person is unique anyway so the comparison is meaningless. I'ts a bit like saying that salt is"better than" pepper. Salt is "betterat" flavouring certain things but it isn't superior to pepper or "better than" pepper because like salt, pepper has it's unique quality and function.
Being able to move away from our feelings and concerns of self and what we think of others and what others think of us and this concern of who is worthy to teach us something, is a spiritual trap we all fall into.
How many of us seek a teacher? Someone who is "better at" this spiritual stuff than we are?
Whilst we are concerned with these issues we cannot find a teacher because we will not be able to recognise they are "better at" something than we are. The teaching is not the teacher and the learning is not the student.
Our attitude to spiritual growth is important. Everyone can teach us something if we have an open mind attitude and a desire and willingness to learn. We are either comitted to growing spiritually or not. If we are not that's ok. If we are comitted, then surely we need to be able to put our thoughts and feelings aside because our spiritual growth and our search for "truth" (whatever that is) is more important thanour feelings of pride, inadequacy, embarassement, suspicion, jealousy, inferiority, vanity, worries, concernsetc, etc because someone is "better at" something than I am.
The good teacherwould neverconsider themselves "better than" any student. They are only "better at" something. Personalities are not the teaching.
When the student is ready, the teacher appears precisely because the student has put these issues aside. Until then, the student cannot learn and the teacher has no one to teach.
:)
Bless
Better than all of you ;)
Bryan
Answers:
Hi Bryan[/align][/align]Do you not consider that our thoughts and feelings are strongly intertwined with our intuition, it is all well and good saying put them aside in the pursuit of spiritual insight and understanding, but if we don't use them then how do we know when we are being steered in the wrong direction.[/align][/align]It is the same when we look for energy connections, if we do not seek with out thoughts and feelings then how do we know if the connection is a good one or a bad one for us, without using our natural abilities it can be aperilous journey.[/align][/align]Thoughts and feeling are our first line of defence, we switch them of at our own peril, I always listen to new ideas andconcepts, but that is not the same as me being a garbage truck with takes onboard everything people throw at it, everything needs to be received with discernment.[/align][/align]We evaluatefirstly our own experiences and consider if the concept fits our remit or understanding, then we evaluate if this concept sits right with us,does it feel right to take onboard, if yes we then test the water and if that all passes muster then we can plunge in and grasp it with both hands.[/align]
Answers:
I've no idea Paul.
I think I was talking about attitude. A mind set which prevents us learning about ourselves and our trying not to think in terms of "better than", which is not a helpful attitude if we are commited to our spiritual growth.
Not really talking here about chosing a teacher. Every experience, even going down the wrong path and beingsteered in the wrong direction,as you put it, can be beneficial if we have the right "attitude"...There are no mistakes...there are only experiences.
We are responsible for the choices we make, no one else. And we can chose to think in terms of others being "better at" something than we are rather than "better than" us... if we want to.
"Better than" attitude doesn't help anyone does it? It simply makes a judgment and stays where it is in a comfort zone. In ego. If we are to grow we have toexamine those issues of the personality which are determined to prevent us from growing and keep us where we are.
Our attitude to learning affects the learning experience. Whilst we are stuck in the "personality issues" of ourselves and others then we can't grow. It's like saying..I'll change when the world changes but not until.
We can make many excuses for not "doing the work" and personality issues is a great excuse for not doing the work. It puts the responsibility on someone or something else.
The only thingthat is important is to grow. And if we are committed to grow then we must examine, if we are not growing, why we are not. In all cases it is our attitude, our mind set and as you know..the mind set which solves a problem is not the same mind set which created it.
Therefore we have to change at a personality level firstnot expect the "other" person or issue to change first and apologise to youfor being there and disturbing you in your comfort zone. This is a lesson in courage. To dare to learn those things about ourselves which we are reluctant to face.
That "other" person or the "issue"is the material which we needfor our spiritual growth. For spiritual work and growth, it is the materialwith which we have to do the work...not the material with which to make excuses about and dismiss so we can avoid the lessons so needed to help us to grow.
It is easy to dimiss that which in actual fact is the very thing we need to face to help us to move on. All experience is positive...if we have the right attitude..in other words...what is this expereince teaching me?
We are either students to life and what life has to teach us or not. Our choice and our responsibility.
To be committed to our growth means we take these things on and face them. Until then, life teaches us the same lesson over and over again in subtle disguises of the same truth and the same lesson.
"Better than" and "better at" is a lesson. When we learn it..we move on. When we don't , we are stuck in it and it's our responsibility, our challenge, no one elses.
Hope that helps
Bless
Bryan
Answers:
I thought it worth repeating Reikilight's point, as I think it is a valid one which can stand alongside Bryan's one concerning attitude.
If I can offer a personal example, for several years I grew upset and angry at a teacher because when I tried to share my passion about my spiritual path experiences, she closed me off. At last we had a heart to heart discussion and I managed to tell her how much she and hurt me through her assumption that I was boasting, when in actual fact I was trying to share. I wonder how many others struggle with this misunderstanding until they can stand outwith it and see the truth?
The other point I wish to make is this - if you feel a posting is ego-ridden, then the answer is simple - don't read it again. Allow the 'irk' to go and move on, because in the end, it is only one person's viewpoint/reality and why should you let it disturb yours? (speaking from the viewpoint of someone who has noticed this yearhow much she can be knocked off balance by ill-advised emotion directed toward a post.. lol)
Blessings
Moonfeather
Answers:
I agree with this in principle, Moonfeather. However, it think it should also be borne in mind that many people come to this forum seeking advice about Reiki, when either they are about to embark on the journey, or have maybe taken some first steps and are seeking reassurance and further knowledge.
At this stage they may not have sufficient experience to be able to differentiate between what are "facts" and what might be someone passionately believing that theirs is the only right and proper way, and coming across as rather "my way or the highway". Then I think a polite post to this effect is OK, because while my own viewpoint/reality might not be affected one little bit, I recognise that for others it might be different, and they might go away with the impresson that what they are doing, or what they have been taught is "wrong". I do try to remember that I once wore L plates! ;)
Holistic